Michelle's baby girl...

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Leah
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Michelle's baby girl...

Postby Leah » Sun Oct 03, 2004 12:15 am

Image

DemBe_Squirrels

Postby DemBe_Squirrels » Mon Oct 04, 2004 6:23 pm

Oh I didnt see this posted...Lookie everyone! Isnt she just beautiful! Thats My Baby!

meganmm

Postby meganmm » Mon Oct 04, 2004 6:25 pm

oh yay! i'm so happy for you!


do you have her yet?

DemBe_Squirrels

Postby DemBe_Squirrels » Mon Oct 04, 2004 6:27 pm

Hi Megan! No I dont have her yet, but will have her on friday! How are you doing? did you get things worked out for your baby?

meganmm

Postby meganmm » Mon Oct 04, 2004 6:31 pm

oh yay, that's so exciting!


i'm doing well, thanks for asking. well, actually, right now i'm racking my brain trying to decide what to do. i found out i don't need a permit after all, phew! BUT i don't know if now is the best time for me to get a squirrel. i'm going to be going out of state (flying) for christmas (to my in-laws) and i'm not sure if i could bring her, and a few other things. so, i'm trying to make up my mind and trying to put my giddyness to have a squirrel aside and make the responsible decision, whatever it may be...so we'll see. hopefully i'll have a decision made by tomorrow.

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Postby Joan » Mon Oct 04, 2004 6:49 pm

DemBe_Squirrels wrote:Oh I didnt see this posted...Lookie everyone! Isnt she just beautiful! Thats My Baby!


Yes, she is ... and I clearly see the resemblance.
:lol:
"A lot of people spend time talking to the Animals, but not that many people listen. That's the real problem! ... Winnie the Pooh

DemBe_Squirrels

Postby DemBe_Squirrels » Mon Oct 04, 2004 6:50 pm

I can understand your dilemma for sure.. really though, if I were you I would wait..unless you know you can be there for every feeding and give baby, mommy and me time.. plus, when your unsure go with the smarter not the hearter.. :D ..

DemBe_Squirrels

Postby DemBe_Squirrels » Mon Oct 04, 2004 6:51 pm

Yup Joan, she has my eyes for sure!

DemBe_Squirrels

Postby DemBe_Squirrels » Mon Oct 04, 2004 6:55 pm

also Megan, you might want to wait till the spring babys and possibly get your youngin from someone off the board..that way you know you are dealing with someone safe..thats fellas shipping seemed abit high, but I could be wrong about that..anyone know the going costs for shipping baby flyers?

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Postby Joan » Mon Oct 04, 2004 7:58 pm

DemBe_Squirrels wrote:also Megan, you might want to wait till the spring babys and possibly get your youngin from someone off the board..that way you know you are dealing with someone safe..thats fellas shipping seemed abit high, but I could be wrong about that..anyone know the going costs for shipping baby flyers?


Be VERY careful who you buy from. Some babies are "harvested" from the wild and shipped illegally as "fish". Or sent throught US mail! Check out: http://www.nfsa.us/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=116
"A lot of people spend time talking to the Animals, but not that many people listen. That's the real problem! ... Winnie the Pooh

DemBe_Squirrels

Postby DemBe_Squirrels » Mon Oct 04, 2004 8:37 pm

Actually I had spoke with this fella, before I found out that Leah had a baby and that she lived near me.. he did have the mama because when I asked him the sexes of the babys, he handed his wife the phone and then had to move mama to look, in which I think he got bit..lol..he was going to ship Continental airline and for shipping and handling I think the cost was about $300..that also included some papers needed, the special travel cage and something else, I cant rememeber..he sounded pretty legit..I was just thinking that with the NFSA people, the adoption of a baby would be more personable..

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Postby Leah » Mon Oct 04, 2004 9:38 pm

Dad-Gum-It...(how's THAT for a guarantee I'm a Southern girl?)

You'd think that with as many times as I post pictures with my horrendous nails showing I would get a blasted manicure, wouldn't you?????

'course, if I had time for a manicure, there'd be no reason to post pictures of my nails (holding babies - which is why I don't have time for a manicure)....

Does anyone else think I need to get some sleep?

DemBe_Squirrels

Postby DemBe_Squirrels » Mon Oct 04, 2004 9:50 pm

Ima thinkin your nails are lookin mighty fine Leah..lol..Us southern gals have no time fur gussying up, gota take care of demdar critters, ya know..

Yes, you need some sleep..lol

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Postby Joan » Mon Oct 04, 2004 9:51 pm

Leah wrote: ...
Does anyone else think I need to get some sleep?


A LoooooNG time ago. :twisted:
"A lot of people spend time talking to the Animals, but not that many people listen. That's the real problem! ... Winnie the Pooh

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Postby katiedid » Tue Oct 05, 2004 1:08 am

What a sweet :lilangel:!!!
~Katie~
Kya :queen:, TC :smt050, Van :smt049 & Squirrelly :wings: ~ Southern Flyers
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Postby Cathy » Tue Oct 05, 2004 8:51 am

Yes, Leah, you need some sleep! But somehow you also need to keep the wonderful pictures coming. So skip the manicure.

When I had SuzieQ shipped to me, the cost for shipping was $130 including the crate and papers. It was on Continental Airlines, which may be the only airline that will ship squirrels.

Please do be careful who you purchase from if you are shipping. The more I handle my sweet little Oakley (from Leah) the more certain I am that SuzieQ was trapped from the wild and resold to me.

Cathy

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Shipping Flying Squirrels

Postby Avalon » Tue Oct 05, 2004 8:58 am

I had two sets of flyers come to me by the airlines. Continental wouldn't fly into Hartford, CT so I hired a driver to take me to Logan Airport in Boston. Bud was friendly right in the car. Blossom is tame but shyer.

I then ordered 3 proven breeders from Helen's Little Critter's in San Antonio, TX. She shipped by American Airlines and I was able to go to Hartford, CT to pick them up.

The flyers came through fine. The box for the Trio was marked that they weren't tame as they were used for breeding. However we've been able to tame them to take pecans from us and jump into our hands.
We are each of us angels with only one wing, and we can only fly by embracing one another.
- Lucretius.

meganmm

Postby meganmm » Tue Oct 05, 2004 9:49 am

oh yes, i called SEVERAL places before deciding on this man. he has a flyer that he keeps as a pet and he adores him, i think he really likes raising flyers a lot more than the money he gets out of it. he's a licensed USDA breeder and he knows much more about flyers than any other breeder that i was able to find. i'm even driving 8 hrs to kansas city to get her if i do decide to get one now, b/c he's such a great guy.

i would, however, LOVE to get a squirrel from someone here b/c i know that they would be loved and spoiled rotten before they got to me. the only thing is, i'm only in the south (virginia) one time of year, and that's for christmas (that's where i'm going). i was considering smuggling her on the plane in my bra, though i don't know how well that'd work. i think i'm gonna hold off for now. i'm just worried that next spring won't be the best time for me to have a baby b/c i may be moving around that time and i would want to give it my undivided attention. so much to consider. if you all have any suggestions for what i might be able to do to get one from one of you, or anything like that, i would really appreciate it.

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Re: Shipping Flying Squirrels

Postby katiedid » Tue Oct 05, 2004 12:23 pm

Avalon wrote:I then ordered 3 proven breeders from Helen's Little Critter's in San Antonio, TX. She shipped by American Airlines and I was able to go to Hartford, CT to pick them up.

The flyers came through fine. The box for the Trio was marked that they weren't tame as they were used for breeding. However we've been able to tame them to take pecans from us and jump into our hands.



Grrr...Not trying to step on any toes, but I really have my misgivings about Helen's Little Critters. :? Eeek! I've never actually said that in a public forum before...but I do not agree with her breeding practices at all, and I am pretty positive that she traps wild flyers...amongst other things... :cry:
~Katie~
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Re: Shipping Flying Squirrels

Postby Joan » Tue Oct 05, 2004 1:25 pm

quote="Avalon"]Grrr...Not trying to step on any toes, but I really have my misgivings about Helen's Little Critters. :? Eeek! I've never actually said that in a public forum before...but I do not agree with her breeding practices at all, and I am pretty positive that she traps wild flyers...amongst other things... :cry:[/quote]

Could you say a little more Avalon? I've read positive posts from HOFs who used her. I don't know a thing about her breeding practices.
"A lot of people spend time talking to the Animals, but not that many people listen. That's the real problem! ... Winnie the Pooh

meganmm

Postby meganmm » Tue Oct 05, 2004 1:32 pm

yeah, i'm just pretty put off by large scale "retailers" as well. i'm sure that some are nice...but it seems much less personable and like the squirrels are not handled nearly as frequently or as lovingly. plus, i kind of question anyone that profits off of animals. i have no problem w/ recooping your expenses, or making a little here and there...but running a large scale business off of little squirrels and things seems so...unethical to me.

i'm sorry, i'm much more outspoken than i probably should be. i know not EVERYONE can be fortunate enough to find a nice breeder who just raises squirrels in their home for recreation...but i wish it could be that way. it seems much more healthy. but, i guess that there can be neglegent breeders no matter what and you just have to make sure you research them. i just wanted to make sure i wasn't supporting some squirrel farm where they breed them and pick them from their mother and sell them w/out them ever having human contact or anything of that sort. i'm weary about anyone/thing that profits off of living creatures though, money can make people do crazy things, and you can't cut corners to make more when you're dealing w/ animals.

i chose not to go w/ a place like Helen's Little Critters, and now that i don't think i'm going to get the squirrel from the man this weekend, i would love to be able to get mine from someone here. i would be glad to pay the same money to someone here, like Leah, who i know deserves the money and can use it to help even more critters than pay someone who profits off of breeding squirrels and doesn't do the great rehabbing work she does.

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Postby Wanda » Tue Oct 05, 2004 3:52 pm

I got Peanut and Shelly from Helen's Little Critters almost a year ago. They have been handfed and are the sweetest little things. I'm sure Venette makes a lot of money off flyers and other critters. I could be wrong but it seems like a reputable breeder to me. She breeds her own flyers (does not catch wild ones), said she had around 250 pups to sell a year ago. She has a vet to examine them all to make sure they are ready to take from Mom and ready to depart to adoptive owners. She takes the pups from Mom around 4 to 5 wks old, hand feeds them, and will not let them go until they are feeding and eating on their own.

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Postby Leah » Tue Oct 05, 2004 4:54 pm

Aww, Megan, thank you for your sweet comments.

You have hit it right on the head for me (again, 'cuz you really did well on the smoking issue - you go, girl!). There is something...just not right - down deep in my gut, anyway...about MAKING money on animals. As Joan says, I will NEVER be out of the hole, money-wise, so it's good that's not why I do it! LOL!

I also (shhhh...) don't believe in keeping wildlife as pets. At least I didn't before one of these little dumplins landed on my doorstep. They did change my mind, at least for this particular species. I can't tell you how happy I am when I find someone who I know will love one of these little sweeties, spoiling them and providing for their every need, as much as I have. No amount of money would make me hand one over to someone I wasn't really, really sure of. Joan says it's easier to adopt a human baby than to pry a flyer pup out of my hands, and she's not far off the mark!

I also would not put one of these babies in a box and ship it anywhere, not if someone had a gun to my head. I know people do it, and I know some good people who do it or have done it in the past...but for me, no way.

I swear, you're reading my mind about popping a flyer in your shirt and passing through airport security. I am dying to try that, just to see if I could. Man, it's hard to pass up a challenge! The only thing that makes me hesitate to try it, is if it all went belly-up and some dude tried to take a flyer from me, I'd really have to get violent and then I'd be in some jail cell somewhere.....and Joan would probably be out kayaking or sailing or some such retiree's activity, and wouldn't be there to bail me out.

Oh, gosh, I've just re-read the above....I REALLY need to get some sleep!

meganmm

Postby meganmm » Tue Oct 05, 2004 5:25 pm

Leah wrote:I also would not put one of these babies in a box and ship it anywhere, not if someone had a gun to my head. I know people do it, and I know some good people who do it or have done it in the past...but for me, no way.

I swear, you're reading my mind about popping a flyer in your shirt and passing through airport security. I am dying to try that, just to see if I could. Man, it's hard to pass up a challenge! The only thing that makes me hesitate to try it, is if it all went belly-up and some dude tried to take a flyer from me, I'd really have to get violent and then I'd be in some jail cell somewhere.....and Joan would probably be out kayaking or sailing or some such retiree's activity, and wouldn't be there to bail me out.


oh goodness, yes, the shipping thing. i mean, i'm sure it's safe, but...i just couldn't bear it. i'm sure it has to be extremely traumatic, then there's the fact that it's not completely safe. one of the places i called told me that they ship, but they have to be careful about the airlines b/c if the cabin pressure changes in the cargo area, the little guys can actually (warning:some of you shouldn't read this word) explode. this man had actually had this happen before. i just...the thought of taking that chance is just...unbearable to me. it makes me want to cry just thinking about it.

you are too sweet though, Leah. hopefully some day, something will work out where i can adopt a baby squirrel from you b/c i imagine that they're the sweetest things on earth...i'll figure out a way to make it happen, i have to.

oh, and about the plane, my cousin recently traveled from michigan to california w/ a lizard in her bra...no joke. so, i'm thinking if she could do that, i could manage a squirrel...okay, i know lizards don't actually make noise and squirrels do, but i think it's worth a try. i figured in the bra for the security checks, then in a fanny pack for the actual plane ride, w/ lots of trips to the bathroom and a mandatory window seat in hopes to muffle any noises. airplanes are pretty loud so i think little cheeps would go unnoticed, especially if you sat near the engine. i'm such a trouble maker. :twisted: but i have to think ahead, i figure if i get mine in spring, i'd have more time to bond so it might be better behaved on the plane ride. plus, i don't want to take a pet that isn't bonded w/ me out of the state, that'd be bad.

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Postby Joan » Tue Oct 05, 2004 5:56 pm

meganmm wrote: ... i'm sorry, i'm much more outspoken than i probably should be.


Leah ... is that you? Why are you calling yourself Megan? :rofl:
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Postby Joan » Tue Oct 05, 2004 6:04 pm

meganmm wrote:... oh goodness, yes, the shipping thing. i mean, i'm sure it's safe, but...i just couldn't bear it. i'm sure it has to be extremely traumatic, then there's the fact that it's not completely safe. one of the places i called told me that they ship, but they have to be careful about the airlines b/c if the cabin pressure changes in the cargo area, the little guys can actually (warning:some of you shouldn't read this word) explode. this man had actually had this happen before. i just...the thought of taking that chance is just...unbearable to me. it makes me want to cry just thinking about it .... oh, and about the plane, my cousin recently traveled from michigan to california w/ a lizard in her bra...no joke. so, i'm thinking if she could do that, i could manage a squirrel...okay, i know lizards don't actually make noise and squirrels do, but i think it's worth a try. i figured in the bra for the security checks, then in a fanny pack for the actual plane ride, w/ lots of trips to the bathroom and a mandatory window seat in hopes to muffle any noises. airplanes are pretty loud so i think little cheeps would go unnoticed, especially if you sat near the engine. i'm such a trouble maker. :twisted: but i have to think ahead, i figure if i get mine in spring, i'd have more time to bond so it might be better behaved on the plane ride. plus, i don't want to take a pet that isn't bonded w/ me out of the state, that'd be bad.


Some time ago, someone posted on a voy forum that they had smuggled their flyer aboard a plane several times. On one flight it died. They didn't know if it had anything to do with cabin pressure, the flight, or something else, but I don't think it's worth it. That pressure makes babies scream and has hurt my ears before. Lord knows what it does to a tiny flyer.
"A lot of people spend time talking to the Animals, but not that many people listen. That's the real problem! ... Winnie the Pooh

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Postby Leah » Tue Oct 05, 2004 6:10 pm

See, Joan is always the cool voice of reason! She is right - not worth the risk.

DemBe_Squirrels

Postby DemBe_Squirrels » Tue Oct 05, 2004 6:16 pm

yall are making me cry :cry:

meganmm

Postby meganmm » Wed Oct 06, 2004 11:42 am

Joan wrote:Some time ago, someone posted on a voy forum that they had smuggled their flyer aboard a plane several times. On one flight it died. They didn't know if it had anything to do with cabin pressure, the flight, or something else, but I don't think it's worth it. That pressure makes babies scream and has hurt my ears before. Lord knows what it does to a tiny flyer.


you know, i was thinking about that last night. i know the problem is w/ pressure, but i was thinking that they might not worry about the pressure in the cargo area as much and that's why there is a problem...but, people fly w/ their pets all the time, so that couldn't be the case. i guess the pressure changes are probably just too much for them to handle, it makes sense.

yes, i definitely will not be trying that, ever. i guess we're driving down next year...:lol:

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Postby crystal3 » Wed Oct 06, 2004 6:39 pm

I know that putting your baby in a box is not the best way to transport and all though its scary when it comes to a baby and doing anything where htere health might be afflicted but Helens little critters flys there babys in a pet section of the plane ( cargo I guess ) and guaruntees that they will be safe! She says she has been doing it for years and has never had a problem! I dont know how accurate that is but lots of people have done it1 I got Petrie from Texas that way and although I don't agree with it I got mine that way because I didnt know of any breeders here in FLorida,(until now)


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Shipping Flying Squirrels

Postby Avalon » Wed Oct 06, 2004 10:16 pm

At the time I ordered my flyers there were no breeders in the MA area and most of New England.

Even if I had known about Beverly adopting out her flyers when she was on Long Island I would not have been able to make a trip down there.

That's the reason I bought pairs of flyers to be able to breed and offer for adoption flyers here in New England.

I've had Bud, Blossom and the Trio for two years now and no ill affects from the plane flight. They were housed in a special cargo section for animals and came through just fine.

I also know of many people that ordered baby flyers from Helen's Little Critters and were very happy with them.
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Re: Shipping Flying Squirrels

Postby Avalon » Wed Oct 06, 2004 10:19 pm

katiedid wrote:Grrr...Not trying to step on any toes, but I really have my misgivings about Helen's Little Critters. :? Eeek! I've never actually said that in a public forum before...but I do not agree with her breeding practices at all, and I am pretty positive that she traps wild flyers...amongst other things


Please elaborate on her breeding practices.
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Postby Wanda » Thu Oct 07, 2004 1:53 am

Helen's Little Critters do fly their flyers in a nursery box in a certified pet carrier in pet cargo section of tle plane and they reach the destination within a matter of a few hours. They are guaranteed. I will not ship a critter but I would not have my flyers now if it weren't for having them flown here and I am glad I did. I would do it in a heartbeat because that is how much I love and want them. There is no way I could drive to Florida, Texas or another far off state. They do not catch the flyers in traps, they are captive born, handfed, and tamed. They bond well and are just as sweet and healthy as any others.

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Postby crystal3 » Thu Oct 07, 2004 9:55 am

Our Golden Retriever pup was 250 for shipping and that was from Kansas to FL so I dont know , but You can call contenintal and ask them yourself. Just go to there website! Getting a baby from the NFSA is the way to go they are so loveable and sweet natured! You can tell the difference between a hand raised baby and a wild one!
Crystal
[quote][/quote]he was going to ship Continental airline and for shipping and handling I think the cost was about $300..that also included some papers needed, the special travel cage and something else, I cant rememeber..he sounded pretty legit..I was just thinking that with the NFSA people, the adoption of a baby would be more personable...[
Last edited by crystal3 on Tue Dec 07, 2004 12:20 am, edited 1 time in total.

meganmm

Re: My Petrie was only 125 to ship by continental the larger

Postby meganmm » Thu Oct 07, 2004 11:12 am

crystal3 wrote:I ONLY PAID 130 FOR MY PETRIE TO BE SHIPPED CONTENINTAL! Our Golden Retriever pup was 250 for shipping and that was from Kansas to FL so I dont know what this guys trying to pull on you but no way no how does it cost 300 for shipping! You can call contenintal and ask them yourself. Just go to there website! Promise its a rip off and as for tryin to make time ffor your little one... if you are going to wait for the perfect opportunity to come before you get one... it probably never will! You just have to know what your getting into and jump in. If they can fly pets on a plane to you in the first place than the little one should be fine going with you for christmas... Don't yo think? Well sorry if I sound so opinionated here... :D
Crystal
he was going to ship Continental airline and for shipping and handling I think the cost was about $300..that also included some papers needed, the special travel cage and something else, I cant rememeber..he sounded pretty legit..I was just thinking that with the NFSA people, the adoption of a baby would be more personable...[


the $300 was for the cost of the flight (it now runs about $175 b/c of gas prices and things like that), a traveling cage, a cert. of health, and a few other things. he said, depending on flight costs b/c they fluxuate that it could be as much as $300 to me. i think if you ship things a lot, you might get a special rate (Helen's Little Critters probably does) but he rarely ships, so he has to pay the normal going rate.

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Postby Joan » Thu Oct 07, 2004 12:12 pm

Here are some figures Dennis gave awhile back:

Buying & Shipping a FS:

Hand tamed baby flyers average $100-$150 each
Health certificate $20
Kennel cab $20
Shipping $90-$250 depending on destination and type of shipping (Since the monkey pox scare, only Continental Airlines will ship flyers. All other airlines have a self emposed ban on shipping them.
They can't be shipped if it is under 32 or over 80 degrees at any airport en route.
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Re: Shipping Flying Squirrels

Postby katiedid » Sun Oct 10, 2004 12:43 am

Avalon wrote:
katiedid wrote:Grrr...Not trying to step on any toes, but I really have my misgivings about Helen's Little Critters. :? Eeek! I've never actually said that in a public forum before...but I do not agree with her breeding practices at all, and I am pretty positive that she traps wild flyers...amongst other things


Please elaborate on her breeding practices.



Sorry, I didn't see this post until now and I need to run. I will elaborate further sometime on Sunday. :)
~Katie~
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Aesop :jester:, Ambraesia, Pepper & Abby :smt057 ~ Sugar Gliders
In loving memory of my little King boy :king: and Sweet Valor

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Postby katiedid » Mon Oct 11, 2004 3:59 pm

Okay, in response to Helen's Little Critters, I do not agree with her breeding practices because I have actually been to her house to pick up my little King.

Don't get me wrong, she is a nice woman, but not all of her animals are given the care they need...if not worse. I can tell that she loves her critters, but loving your critters and properly taking care of them is a totally different thing.

1.) She had...mmm...my guess is approx. 60 flyer pups in a small, wire mesh "container". It was divided into sections approximately 4"x4" with 3 to 4 flyers each in it. Their bedding was shredded newspaper.

2.) The adult flyers are not tame to my knowledge because she was telling me how she had to send her daughter out to the barn to go and catch them because she couldn't. Apparently she has a ranch where she has flyers. I'm not sure where this ranch is.

3.) She breeds way too many animal species and way too many animals to be able to appropriately care for the breeders. I know many, many sugar glider breeders who are busy with just sugar gliders (it takes all of their time). There's no way she can spend quality time with flyers, sugar gliders, hedgehogs, hamsters, birds, etc.

4.) She breeds gliders and the gliders that I saw in her home were tiny babies (less than the weaned 8 weeks of age) being stored in those tiny fish/reptile plastic aquariums with the only bedding being shredded newspaper.

5.) She had a 40 gallon tub full of pine bedding with hedgehogs...and one hedgehog had a severly injured foot that had not been tended to.

6.) She had a ton of bird cages in her backyard with all sorts of birds in them. All the cages appeared to be too small for freedom of movement.

7.) She has sold unweened sugar glider babies to people in the glider community and she has also practiced un-safe neutering herself on these tiny babies. Although I do not agree with everything that Glider University has to say, this is a story about Helen's Little Critters:

http://www.glideruniversity.org/main/content/view/44/2/


These are my observations. I am not trying to start a heated debate, but I do care about the welfare of all animals.
Last edited by katiedid on Mon Oct 11, 2004 6:58 pm, edited 2 times in total.
~Katie~
Kya :queen:, TC :smt050, Van :smt049 & Squirrelly :wings: ~ Southern Flyers
Aesop :jester:, Ambraesia, Pepper & Abby :smt057 ~ Sugar Gliders
In loving memory of my little King boy :king: and Sweet Valor

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Leah
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Postby Leah » Mon Oct 11, 2004 4:07 pm

Oh, dear God! I have tears streaming down my face. I am sick to my stomach.

Thank you, Katie, for being brave and sharing this with us.

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Avalon
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Postby Avalon » Mon Oct 11, 2004 4:33 pm

It would be nice to put these places out of business. My cages are huge and I have four in one and three in the other. I would love to have a room where I wouldn't have to keep my flyers caged.
We are each of us angels with only one wing, and we can only fly by embracing one another.
- Lucretius.


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